Medjugorje Forum

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2017 3:45 pm 
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Headline says more than the article... but what does it mean, “regulate the phenomenon”

Can the phenomenon be more regular than the 2nd and 25th of each month?

Or is the ‘phenomenon’ a reference to the spiritual fruits and not the apparitions and their promotion?

http://www.lastampa.it/2017/11/01/vatic ... agina.html

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2017 6:22 pm 
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The structure of the Stampa headline is not clear, and is different than the form you used in the thread subject. The Stampa headline mentions 'Medjogorje, Parolin' and then puts quotes around the comment in question.

So we are left to wonder whether Parolin (and the town of Medjugorge for that matter) actually said that. Or whether the sentence is the Stampa reporters interpretation of what he thinks Parolin said.

The body of the article does not repeat that comment to give clarity.

The format of the thread subject you used gives the impression that the cardinal actually said that.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2017 7:08 pm 
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Obviously, the potential for extremes is there and makes the powers that be nervous. I always wondered if the Pope could rein in the priest that is too fast and then read to public the parchment warning.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2017 8:30 pm 
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The headline implies it is the cardinal’s words… why use quotes otherwise?

No one else is quoted in the article other than the cardinal.

The usual get out for journalists in this situation is to say: “I don’t write the headlines… check with the sub-editor”.

Hence my questions.

Quote:
the potential for extremes is there...

Which is probably why the Holy See is structuring a programme of pastoral guidance. By implying that the faithful have needs in pastoral guidance suggests that not all is hunk-dory at Medjugorje, despite the recognised spiritual fruits and the Commission’s vote in accepting the validity of the apparitions that happened during the first week or so.

Vatican Insider reported as far back as January 2014:

Quote:
Vatican Insider has learnt that the Commission has focused mainly on the first phase of apparitions [...] Some of the Commission’s members have highlighted the need for a change of pace in the provision of pastoral care to millions of faithful who come to Medjugorje from all over the world…

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2017 9:24 pm 
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If someone says they want to "regulate the (Medjugorge) phenomenon", we can understand it as a way of saying they want to control or supervise it by means of imposition of regulations.

Regulating something means that you desire to take an active role in managing the thing, adjust its operational qualities, guiding it, and even correcting it if its direction is not according to that which you desire.

How would one 'regulate' Medjugorje? The Vatican Secretary of State's answer talked about the pastoral care of the pilgrims who go there. Maybe this is what he was referring to. Since January of 2014 they expressed a need for a "change of pace". Why?

It begs the question what the Vatican deems is lacking in the pastoral care given to date. Was it sub-par? Or even non existent?.

Just what would the Vatican like to do to "provide for the needs of the faithful who go there"?

'Regulation' can be benign and benevolent, or it can be suffocating and controlling.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2017 10:52 pm 
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Pastoral care... regulate... as in ‘regular’... as opposed to ‘irregular’...

Tornielli touched on this when he reported on the Commission outcome for Vatican Insider on May 16, 2017:

The emphasis is mine.

Quote:
In addition, 13 members and experts out of the 14 present voted in favor of the constitution of “an authority dependent on the Holy See” in Medjugorje as well as the transformation of the parish into a pontifical sanctuary. A decision based on pastoral reasons - the care of millions of pilgrims, avoiding the formation of “parallel churches”, clarity on economic issues - which would not imply the recognition of the supernatural nature of the apparitions.

As recently as last month the Pope discussed the rise of ‘parallel churches’... https://cruxnow.com/vatican/2017/09/19/ ... -churches/

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2017 12:56 am 
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The current situation with Medjugorje may be understood in this letter from the CDF sent to bishops in June 2016... http://www.catholicherald.co.uk/news/20 ... o-bishops/

It’s a lengthy text but well worth the time reading.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 03, 2017 12:06 pm 
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More on Cardinal Parolin’s recent quote to Croatia media...

The is a Google translation for part of the report that appeared in Swedish via Vatican Radio...

Quote:
"In addition to the supernatural events, the pastoral care of pilgrims is important. It is the will of the Holy See to help legitimize the phenomenon so that the believers who come here can listen to the word of God, celebrate the sacraments, and experience true faithfulness. "

‘Legitimize” instead of “regulate”

So what aspects of Medjugorje could be considered “illegitimate” (“not authorised by the law; not in accordance with accepted standards or rules.”)

I suspect that when the Holy See does pronounce officially on the outcome of the international commission’s investigation into the ‘phenomenon’, it will also make clear what it considers to be in breach of the law. Unlike, the Zadar declaration there will be no ‘middle ground’ pronouncement. It will be made clear what is acceptable and what isn’t, so that the faithful are not misled.

I’m guessing no move to declare Medjugore a pontifical sanctuary will happen until the Mostar bishop retires in 18 months time, but during that period moves will be put in place ready for the date of February 2, 2019.

Followers of Mirjana’s messages and her claims will know that the seer has said the choice of the 2nd of the month date is for a reason, which will be understood in time. :)

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 11, 2017 11:40 pm 
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They regulated Fatimah, and stiffled the messages coming out until years later


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2017 7:02 pm 
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I would say the message coming from Our Lady is the same at all Marian shrines: “Do whatever he tells you.” (John 2 : 5)

It recalls the passage from Genesis and the time of the famine that Joseph had predicted.
Quote:
There was famine in every country, but there was bread to be had throughout the land of Egypt. When the whole country began to feel the famine, the people cried out to Pharaoh for bread. But Pharaoh told all the Egyptians, “Go to Joseph and do what he tells you.”
Genesis 41 : 54-55

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